Sharp tongue Charlie
ALSO ALSO ALSO

fuguestasis:

Humor is linked to shared experience (so says Bo Burnham!). When someone makes a shitty joke about “it’s not rape if you say surprise!” the punchline isn’t just “HAHAHAHAHA—rape is funny!” like so many feminists claim it is. The punchline is also the unifying, community-defining idea that it’s okay to rape and that the punishment and social stigma that is supposedly enforced against rapists doesn’t really exist. Jokes are a way to define in-group beliefs, practices, and standards for normalcy.

So. When survivors make jokes about our experiences, we’re defining our own in-group and creating standards for normalcy that include us and acknowledges the ironic weirdness of being surrounded by the dominant culture but having history that is largely erased by the dominant culture. Like, I make jokes to other friends-who-have-survived-domestic-violence about how I generally expect some amount of violence to accompany romantic relationships (this is less true now that it historically has been) and how this leads to a weird double-standard where violence itself isn’t a deal-breaker (because I kind of figured it would happen!) BUT not being clear about what exactly you’re mad about *is* (because you should at least have the decency to tell me how much violence I should expect, Jesus Christ!). And it’s not supposed to normalize domestic violence; it’s supposed to normalize survivors of domestic violence and also just the act of surviving domestic violence itself. 

I think a lot of feminists—or just people who are generally anti-rape—who haven’t experienced sexual assault don’t get this because they don’t really understand or value the personhood of survivors so much as they want to dismantle a very lazily abstracted idea of “rape culture.”

^ Yes

[TW:rape culture]

To all those who don’t think the rape joke was a problem, or rape jokes are a problem.

I get it, you’re a decent guy. I can even believe it. You’ve never raped anybody. You would NEVER rape anybody. You’re upset that all these feminists are trying to accuse you of doing something or connect you to doing something that, as far as you’re concerned, you’ve never done and would never condone.

And they’ve told you about triggers, and PTSD, and how one in six women is a survivor, and you get it. You do. But you can’t let every time someone gets all upset get in the way of you having a good time, right?

So fine. If all those arguments aren’t going anything for you, let me tell you this. And I tell you this because I genuinely believe you mean it when you say you don’t want to hurt anybody, and you don’t see the harm, and that it’s important to you to do your best to be a decent and good person. And I genuinely believe you when you say you would never associate with a rapist and you think rape really is a very bad thing.

Because this is why I refuse to take rape jokes sitting down-

6% of college age men, slightly over 1 in 20, will admit to raping someone in anonymous surveys, as long as the word “rape” isn’t used in the description of the act.

6% of Penny Arcade’s target demographic will admit to actually being rapists when asked.

A lot of people accuse feminists of thinking that all men are rapists. That’s not true. But do you know who think all men are rapists?

Rapists do.

They really do. In psychological study, the profiling, the studies, it comes out again and again.

Virtually all rapists genuinely believe that all men rape, and other men just keep it hushed up better. And more, these people who really are rapists are constantly reaffirmed in their belief about the rest of mankind being rapists like them by things like rape jokes, that dismiss and normalize the idea of rape.

If one in twenty guys is a real and true rapist, and you have any amount of social activity with other guys like yourself, really cool guy, then it is almost a statistical certainty that one time hanging out with friends and their friends, playing Halo with a bunch of guys online, in a WoW guild, or elsewhere, you were talking to a rapist. Not your fault. You can’t tell a rapist apart any better than anyone else can. It’s not like they announce themselves.

But, here’s the thing. It’s very likely that in some of these interactions with these guys, at some point or another someone told a rape joke. You, decent guy that you are, understood that they didn’t mean it, and it was just a joke. And so you laughed.

And, decent guy who would never condone rape, who would step in and stop rape if he saw it, who understands that rape is awful and wrong and bad, when you laughed?

That rapist who was in the group with you, that rapist thought that you were on his side. That rapist knew that you were a rapist like him. And he felt validated, and he felt he was among his comrades.

You. The rapist’s comrade.

And if that doesn’t make you feel sick to your stomach, if that doesn’t make you want to throw up, if that doesn’t disturb you or bother you or make you feel like maybe you should at least consider not participating in that kind of humor anymore…

Well, maybe you aren’t as opposed to rapists as you claim.

[Source] (via keylimepie)

This is the article I send to people who don’t see the problem with rape jokes. 

(via feministfairytale)

My favourite part was “6% of Penny Arcade’s target demographic will admit to actually being rapists when asked.” ZING

(via amararama)

always reblog

(via rattyhugs)

Anonymous asked: What are your thoughts on rape victims who use rape jokes as a means to cope with their experience?

jewelweed:

whatfreshhellisthis:

fugue-stasis:

whatfreshhellisthis:

Good for them?

As long as they’re doing it in a way that takes the people who’re hearing it into consideration, then frankly whatever they need to do is none of my or anyone else’s business.

I occasionally make jokes where my experiences with sexual assaults and rape are the punchline. They’re dark, dry and bitter- not so much funny as cathartic, but I’ve made them. However, I only ever do so around people who I know are ok with that.

Pretty much!

I’d also argue that dark, cathartic jokes about something you’ve experienced look very different from “rape jokes” that are created to define community values in line with rape culture.

Oh absolutely. In my mind, there is absolutely a difference between a ‘rape joke’ and a ‘joke about rape where the teller knows exactly what they’re joking about because they have experienced it’.

One, whether directly or not, references personal experience. The other references tropes, myths and common beliefs about an experience.

Guess which one directly upholds rape culture.

I’ve been having this conversation with my partner a lot lately, and I think a key part of using your experience as a joke is, well, audience.

If you’re a mainstream comic who has survived sexual abuse and assault, telling jokes about rape and assault to an audience that HASN’T experienced those things and therefore IS mentally referencing tropes, myths, and common beliefs…is that still an okay thing to do? I don’t know. I’m still wrestling with this in my mind.

I mean… I’m incredibly uncomfortable with the idea of telling jokes without taking the people who are hearing them into consideration, and of course as a comedian you can’t know the history of everyone who comes to your shows, but the statistics bear out that you are going to be talking to some survivors there.

I’d argue that depends very much on the joke in question; making it clear that you’re talking about something you’ve experienced as opposed to the rape-culture reifying ‘hahaha then rape’ type things.

In terms of talking about personal experiences, I think it’s always going to depend on context.

I mean, a queer comic joking about queer culture is different to a non-queer comic doing the same, both in the jokes they’d choose to tell, they way they’d tell it… everything. The context would utterly change the entire content of the humor.

So the context of a rape survivor talking and joking about rape is always going to be so, so different to that of a non-survivor doing so that it’s almost functionally worthless to compare them.

Anonymous asked: What are your thoughts on rape victims who use rape jokes as a means to cope with their experience?

fugue-stasis:

whatfreshhellisthis:

Good for them?

As long as they’re doing it in a way that takes the people who’re hearing it into consideration, then frankly whatever they need to do is none of my or anyone else’s business.

I occasionally make jokes where my experiences with sexual assaults and rape are the punchline. They’re dark, dry and bitter- not so much funny as cathartic, but I’ve made them. However, I only ever do so around people who I know are ok with that.

Pretty much!

I’d also argue that dark, cathartic jokes about something you’ve experienced look very different from “rape jokes” that are created to define community values in line with rape culture.

Oh absolutely. In my mind, there is absolutely a difference between a ‘rape joke’ and a ‘joke about rape where the teller knows exactly what they’re joking about because they have experienced it’.

One, whether directly or not, references personal experience. The other references tropes, myths and common beliefs about an experience.

Guess which one directly upholds rape culture.

Also, one of the reblogs on that rant says something like “well if I KNOW I’m talking to a rape victim then I wouldn’t make a rape joke, duh”

Yeah, slight flaw in your wicked cool plan there buddy:

Unless they’ve told you their status RE: rape, sexual assult, molestation and other forms of sexual attack

You can’t tell!

No really, I don’t have a flashing sign on my forehead saying “THIS ONE HAS BEEN RAPED, MOLESTED AND SEXUALLY ASSAULTED BETTER NOT JOKE AROUND THEM HUR HUR HUR!”

And honestly dudebro, rape and sexual assault is fucking common. You walk into a room with sixty USian women in it, ten of them will have been or will be raped. You walk into a room with a hundred USian men, three of them will have been.

The likelihood of you knowing someone who’s been raped or sexually assaulted is so high I’d be willing to bet everything I own that you do.

And one day if you keep telling rape jokes this person you know- probably even persons- is going to hear, and they’re going to be glad they never told you.

Because if you can laugh about rape so easily, what on earth would you do to them if you knew? Would you laugh then too?

And just as likely, one day you’ll be telling that joke, about that bitch who got what she deserved, and a rapist will hear you. And he’ll laugh. And he’ll think that you’re on his side.

And as far as I know, person who told that joke, you are.

[TRIGGER WARNING] Knock knock, who’s there, rape.

anotherfeministblog:

whatfreshhellisthis:

pigeon-life:

whatfreshhellisthis:

But, it’s funny, right, because rape? Because rape is one of the single most horrific things a person can go through, right? Funny, yeah? Because survivors have to hear this all the time from every person who thinks they’re being edgy, right, when all they’re doing is…

Just because people joke about something doesn’t mean they don’t care about it, it just means they want to make people laugh for a few second and forget all the shitty things in the world. I may joke about black people, but it doesn’t mean I hate them and am hoping for a second holocaust. I know rape is bad, but a joke should not be taken seriously.

Because rape is fucking hilarious, as is racism.

Seriously, do you actually pay attention to the words you spout or just sort of say them?

Joking about rape normalises it.

Rapists (much like racists!) think that everyone else is the same as them. They don’t see non-consent as an issue. They think that when people react with horror it’s an overreaction, said just to fit in.

[TRIGGER WARNING: RAPE, VICTIM BLAMING, RAPE CULTURE]

Bitches deserve what they get. Men can’t say no. She’s not a real woman so it’s not rape, right brah? He’s got a vagina, yeah, what a fucking freak, right? I’m going to put you in your place you fucking faggot, I’m a real man, they’re my partner- they’re always up for it, well ze’s not saying no, she’s a slut, ey can’t tell so it doesn’t matter, she’s so old no one will believe her; who’d fuck a dried up prune like that, she was asking for it look at that fucking skirt for fuck’s sake, he can barely stand up but heyyy looks like he’s got a boner, wanna have fun big guy you’re a real man right, the dyke’s just fucking fridged; do her and she’ll realise what she’s missing, yeah, yeah yeah

Your hahahaha bro, she said no but fuck that right, ahahaha? Hahahaa, yeah, they raped me hard ahahahaa, man I’m gonna rape your face so bad man!

Yeah, doesn’t exactly do much to disabuse them of that notion.

NEWSFLASH: STUDY FINDS THAT WHEN YOU JOKE ABOUT SHITTY THINGS YOU REINFORCE THOSE SHITTY THINGS.

“Our research demonstrates that exposure to sexist humor can create conditions that allow men – especially those who have antagonistic attitudes toward women – to express those attitudes in their behavior…The acceptance of sexist humor leads men to believe that sexist behavior falls within the bounds of social acceptability.”

-source

pigeon-life:

whatfreshhellisthis:

But, it’s funny, right, because rape? Because rape is one of the single most horrific things a person can go through, right? Funny, yeah? Because survivors have to hear this all the time from every person who thinks they’re being edgy, right, when all they’re doing is…

Just because people joke about something doesn’t mean they don’t care about it, it just means they want to make people laugh for a few second and forget all the shitty things in the world. I may joke about black people, but it doesn’t mean I hate them and am hoping for a second holocaust. I know rape is bad, but a joke should not be taken seriously.

Because rape is fucking hilarious, as is racism.

Seriously, do you actually pay attention to the words you spout or just sort of say them?

Joking about rape normalises it.

Rapists (much like racists!) think that everyone else is the same as them. They don’t see non-consent as an issue. They think that when people react with horror it’s an overreaction, said just to fit in.

[TRIGGER WARNING: RAPE, VICTIM BLAMING, RAPE CULTURE]

Bitches deserve what they get. Men can’t say no. She’s not a real woman so it’s not rape, right brah? He’s got a vagina, yeah, what a fucking freak, right? I’m going to put you in your place you fucking faggot, I’m a real man, they’re my partner- they’re always up for it, well ze’s not saying no, she’s a slut, ey can’t tell so it doesn’t matter, she’s so old no one will believe her; who’d fuck a dried up prune like that, she was asking for it look at that fucking skirt for fuck’s sake, he can barely stand up but heyyy looks like he’s got a boner, wanna have fun big guy you’re a real man right, the dyke’s just fucking fridged; do her and she’ll realise what she’s missing, yeah, yeah yeah

Your hahahaha bro, she said no but fuck that right, ahahaha? Hahahaa, yeah, they raped me hard ahahahaa, man I’m gonna rape your face so bad man!

Yeah, doesn’t exactly do much to disabuse them of that notion.